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This episode rocked, on so many different levels, it wasn't even funny.

The scene in the oval office with the joke on Toby was great.

Then Abby cutting Bartlett's tie, right before the debate....LMAO.

As for the debate itself. I have to agree with C.J. "Oh my God!" Bartlett totally rocked Gov Richie, and at the end even Richie knew it....ROFLMAO. So muuch for Gov. Richie's campaign.

IMO, the best line of the whole episode had to be Leo's, when he was talking with the diplomat. "You think the President would LOOSE votes if he admitted to killing (can't remember the guys name)?" Leo laughs. "All the President would have to do to win the election with a landslide would be to put a bullet through the Sultan's brain, then walk across time square and by a hot dog!"

Can this show get any better? I think not.

And yes, there was some significant amounts of rocking in this ep.

You know, it's strange - people today are more cynical about politicians and politics than ever before. Fewer people want to pursue careers in public service (particulary the younger generation), and there's little debate about truly imortant issues outside of newspaper Op-Ed columns. And yet, here's this TV show that's all about politics and public service, and it's extremely popular. People love West Wing even if they hate politicians, and they love Bartlet even when they've lost faith in the real President. There's something about The West Wing that strips off the cynical, self-serving veneer that coats modern politics and gets to the real heart of the issues. In a way, this show is like the debate in "Game On" - it's a drama, a game, but underneath the entertainment, real, subtantive ideas are being explored by contrasting one against another. On one level, it's an excellent ensemble drama with suberb actors and top of the line production values, but on another level it's all about exploring ideas, and that's why I love it so much.

Somehow, I doubt this will be Bartlet's last debate. A man like him has ways of getting into trouble (so to speak) even after he leaves office. He couldn't stay silent if someone like Ritchie succeeded him.

On another note, it looks like Sam is very interested in pursuing that senate seat. Will Bailey's quixotic fight to depose the incumbent Republican in that district (and get people talking about the issues) is the sort of idealistic, damn the torpedoes thing that Sam can't resist. No doubt this is the beginning of his exit from the show.

And now we know the names of Toby's future children: Beatrice and Bluto. Poor kids.

[This message has been edited by Kevin Street (edited October 31, 2002).]

quote:

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Originally posted by jesseja:
....i can't resist pointing out either that WW has so many story arcs, something andromeda is running away from.[/B]

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Good story-telling is like that: it let's you in on the action and makes you feel welcomed, no matter when you show up.

*star*

Next thing was setting up the congressman and how we have throw away competition and Sam didn't like that not trying.

Now we get to see the dead congressman's campaign and Sam saying if they won he would run for the seat.

So I think they are setting up his departure well.

quote:

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Originally posted by Kevin Street:
You know, it's strange - people today are more cynical about politicians and politics than ever before. Fewer people want to pursue careers in public service (particulary the younger generation), and there's little debate about truly imortant issues outside of newspaper Op-Ed columns. And yet, here's this TV show that's all about politics and public service, and it's extremely popular. People love West Wing even if they hate politicians, and they love Bartlet even when they've lost faith in the real President. There's something about The West Wing that strips off the cynical, self-serving veneer that coats modern politics and gets to the real heart of the issues. In a way, this show is like the debate in "Game On" - it's a drama, a game, but underneath the entertainment, real, subtantive ideas are being explored by contrasting one against another. On one level, it's an excellent ensemble drama with suberb actors and top of the line production values, but on another level it's all about exploring ideas, and that's why I love it so much.

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If only we had any reason at all to believe that the people in the White House were this dedicated, this committed to doing the best for everyone, this honest, this....

You get the picture.

Yeah, we're all cynical about politics and politicians. Look at most of this year's campaigns...exercises in smear tactics and all negative.

The question is, are we getting the candidates our cynicism deserves, or did we lose interest and, as a result, campaigns and politians became the way they are today? Do we need better leaders to become better citizens or if we become better citizens, will we be rewarded with better leaders?

Clearly TWW is an idealized kind of White House, and yet, Republican or Democrat, I think there are elements about the way the staff behaves and the way that they care so deeply that inspire us.

There is an honesty, a respect for their opponents, and a dedication to the welfare and safety of the citizens that's enormously appealing in this show.

And, as someone pointed out, we get to see them wrestling with moral dilemmas, arguing both sides of the question, and taking their courage in hand to take action.

This was a great episode, BTW. Loved the bit with the tie.