In the Officer's Quarters, we've been talking about this for a few days. I apologise for not posting about this at the public area of the board first, but I felt that it was important to first talk things through with the mods - they, after all, are the persons who are responsible for keeping this a fun place where people respect the rules we've decided upon.

We think that a lot of the problems that we've been having are not just due to the appearance of one member who many people see as a troll, but also because of the fact that this board is growing. We're no longer the small community of just a hundred members - we've got over a thousand members, and once new episodes start airing it wouldn't surprise me if we hit the 2000 members before the year is over.

Any bulletin board that grows is unfortunately going to face problems. Boards that are large and popular are much more of an attraction to people who want to cause trouble. On large boards, not everyone knows each other closely anymore, meaning we're sometimes unclear about the intent of other posters. Most importantly, on a large board the frequency of problems will increase - even if only one in a thousand threads is a problem thread, if you've got a million threads you're going to have more problem threads than if you've only got a couple of new threads per day.

Because the board is getting larger, it also won't be possible anymore to handle problems in the way we used to. In a community of a hundred members, it's possible to deal with problems as they arise, simply because there aren't too many of them. But on a larger board, it's important to have some structure, so that similar problems are dealt with in similar ways and the members know what to expect.

For that reason, we've come up with the following ideas and changes that will be implemented:

1 - The opening of a 'Questions, Suggestions & Feedback' forum.

Miscellaneous is intended, according to the forum main page, to "hang out with your fellow BBS members." At the moment, in some threads it's looking more like the purpose is to "hang your fellow BBS members." That's really not what Misc is for - we want it to be there to discuss things that don't have to do with Andromeda or Science Fiction, but that's a lot harder if it's also used to discuss all sorts of problems with the BBS itself.

Therefore, we've decided to open a special forum where you can post Questions, Suggestions & Feedback - and aptly enough, that will also be the title of the forum. It will be moderated by Lisa, meaning that all three administrators here will now be moderating a forum. In this forum, you will be able to post if you feel something here at the BBS is not working as it should, or you will be able to ask questions about how the BBS is running - the admins and mods will be here to respond to these.

Once this forum has started, it really should be the only place to discuss matters concerning the BBS itself. Right now, not only is Misc kind of a battlefield, many individual threads that start out promising usually are also quickly destroyed if there is a problem thread. In the future, if someone makes what you consider to be an offensive post or a flame or a trolling post in a thread, do not start complaining about it in that thread, but post about it in QSF. If you do respond to what you consider to be a troll, you'll only be helping him - instead of having been able to make just one post, the troll will now have the satisfaction of having been able to derail an entire thread.

I really need to stress that we want to keep Misc and the other forums a fun place again, and so we need to act against these kinds of actions. If someone posts and you think they are a troll, do not flame them back or start a new thread in Misc about it - post about what you feel should be done in QSF, and make sure not to also be offensive with your own post.

2 - A revision and closer adherence to the BBS Policy

From now on, we're going to be very clear about how we handle problems at the BBS. Everything that people are not allowed to do is included in the BBS policy. Everything that we will do if people break these rules is included in the BBS policy. The policy is the set of rules that we've decided are good for the BBS - it lists exactly those kinds of offensive behaviour that should not occur here on the BBS, and will be acted against. If people do something that is not breaking these rules, they're not being offensive, and so they should not be acted against.

The policy is really quite good at catching trouble-makers. Let's look, for instance, at how we would have been able to handle the problem surrounding the Skinofevil member. If we had already been actively using the BBS policy, Skinofevil would have received warnings for this thread, which started with a highly offensive and clearly trolling message. In addition, while he would not have received a warning for his first message in this thread (as it was a valid question that actuall led to some debate), he would have received a warning for his second post, which was clearly offensive.

As you see, with the policy we would have been and in the future will be able to catch truly offensive material. However, while we will be acting against offensive posts and if members continue to make offensive posts against those members, what we will not (and what the membership should not) be doing is to act against posts that are not offensive. An example is this thread, where Skinofevil was asking a perfectly valid question, one of the kind that in the future will also be welcome in the Questions, Suggestions & Feedback forum.

If we start attacking people that we consider to be trolls for every post that they make, even the non-offensive ones, then we're basically letting them win. They no longer need to post offensive content to disrupt the BBS - they can just post anything they want and can be assured that the BBS will still be up in arms about them. That is not the way we need to go.

Just to make this perfectly clear - we are not going soft on trolls. We have absolute no desire at all to protect trolls. But there is an important difference between acting against clearly offensive and trolling posts by people, which we will be doing, and deciding someone is a troll and then start a witchhunt against them, which we will certainly not be doing. That kind of thing also disrupts the BBS, and we intend to stop that as well.

From now on, we will be fair, but strict. If you flame someone, no matter who you are, you will get a warning. If you make a trolling post with offensive content, no matter who you are, you will get a warning.

What this also means is that you flame people you see as trolls, no matter who you are, you will also get a warning, because you would also be lowering the atmosphere on the board. If you open threads in other forums than QSF on BBS matters, they will be closed and transfered to QSF. If you persist, no matter who you are, you will also be warned. Not only do we have to act against trouble-makers, we also have to act against those who escalate the trouble.

You may be wondering what those warnings exactly mean. The system we have is as follows:
If you get two warnings within a period of seven days, you will be banned for a day. Four warnings received within a period of a month will mean a one-week ban. Six or more warnings within a period of three months will lead to a one-month ban.

If people come back from bans, do not attack them. They have had their punishment, and have hopefully improved their ways. If they have not, they will be banned again, this time for a longer period. Do not take it upon yourself to add some extra punishment to the one that they already have received.

To review the BBS policy, please follow this link. I hope you'll all agree that it really is quite thorough and explains to everyone what they can expect.

3 - New moderators

We haven't yet decided on who these will be, but some new moderators will be brought in to handle the load. Some forums that require new moderators are General Discussion, which could use a second one to ease some off the load for Andi, Episodes, and Misc.

4 - Skinofevil

Skinofevil has already received two warnings. As outlined above, he has made at least two more posts which are considered so offensive that they would get warnings. While we would not normally give out retrospective bans, in this case it is warranted, because the policy was not being adhered to as strictly when these posts were posted, but they clearly were offensive. Saying that because the policy was not being adhered to Skinofevil should not be getting warnings for these won't work - the policy always existed and always prohibited offensive posts, and should be adhered to even if it slips past a moderator.

Because of these four warnings, Skinofevil will be banned for a week. Once he gets back, again, do not attack him and cause a massive disturbance - if he truly is a troll, you would be giving him exactly what he wants by disturbing the board in that way. If he does offensive things, then we will act against him. If he does not, tolerate him, ignore him, do what you want, but do not attack him.

*

I know that some of these changes will be unwelcome to some members. You may think that we're changing the nature of the board by these changes. But we're not. We're reacting to the changes this board is already going through. It's a lot larger than it was a year ago, and it will only be growing larger over the next year. The only way in which we could keep this board the exact same way that it is now would be to lock registrations permanently and not allow in any new people - but if we did that, that would mean a slow death for the board, as the people who would inevitably leave for whatever reason that people leave for would not be replaced by new people.

To keep the board alive and vibrant, we need to be open, welcoming, and tolerant to new people. At the same time, we need to make sure that trouble-makers do not get a chance. To do that, a clear structure is required, so that members know what they should and should not do and know what they can expect from the mods, and so that mods know what they should do if members do not follow these rules.

*

If you have any questions about this, please post them in this thread. If you have any questions about other issues, please post them in the QSF forum, which will be opened in a few minutes.

Thank you all for reading this fairly huge post, as well as for your patience and cooperation. We're all here to make this BBS a fun place - let's work together to make sure it is able to stay this way.

Rhys

------------------
Eldorado Drift, home of the Unofficial Laura Bertram Fan Club
(Drop by and get your ULBFC Membership Number!)

--------------------
The Unofficial Laura Bertram Fan Club & Eldorado Drift

------------------
The English Bekaneer.....

I do it for the joy it brings.....

--------------------
The English Bekaneer.....
I do it for the joy it brings.....

Thanks for taking action.

------------------
-=-=-=-=-= Techfreak Ziana =-=-=-=-=-
3.12 GCS/MC/IT/L/O d- s-:- a? C++++ UL
P+ L+ W+++ N+ w+ M-- PS+++ PE Y+ D+
PGP-- t+@ 5++ X R tv+ b+++ DI++++ UF++
"Exciting things are coming!" -Nikola Tesla
Harper fanatic!
Honourary: Bekaneer, Dylanite, Roman, Trancer, Tyrant, Wayist/Reverant, Rhadical, Tyrancer, DylaTrancer, Bekancer, Magniac, Than Hegemonist, Consensus Constituent

Ahem.

*applauds the Christian*

------------------

------------------
Loving Husband to Amanda (missing), Senar, Jade, and Raeven
Caring father to Safek, Aman-ra, and Osiris
He knows his way in the dark/Mine is the way of the Lord/And those who follow the path of the righteous/Shall have their reward/And if they fall/As Lucifer fell/The flame/The sword!--Javert, "Stars", "Les Miserables"
Marching to a different Quast.
"Dålig bortsett från underhållande."
What would Javert do?

Thanks, Christian, for addressing our concerns in such a fair and even-handed manner. This ought to make our BBS a nicer place to visit once again.

--------------------
Author, "A Perilous Tipping of Scales"

quote:

---

Originally posted by Lisa:
You see, this is why he doesn't post much. When he does post, it takes him three hours to write his thoughts down

Ahem.

*applauds the [b]Christian*

[/B]

---

LOL

I have to agree with what Christian said and support him on it

////////Christian
//////// Lisa
//////// Mods

Strae

Stricter guidelines???

THREE new mods???

ALRIGHT!!!

{{{{{ Administrators }}}}} Thank you for your hard work on this matter. You have made the SS community a great place to be.

That goes the same for you all.

{{{{{ Everyone }}}}}

"Hang your fellow BBS Members"? ROFLMAO!!!!

*ahem*

--------------------
[i]What if everything you see is more than what you see-the person next to you is a warrior and the space that appears empty is a secret door to another world? What if something appears that shouldn't? You either dismiss it, or you accept that there is much more to the world than you think. Perhaps it really is a doorway, and if you choose to go inside, you'll find many unexpected things.-Shigeru Miyamoto

-Amanda

--------------------
I have two arms, I will hug you. Don't mess with me.
Matriarch of the Nietzschean Empire.

Thank you Christian.
And is good to know that you exist!

Arcadia

[This message has been edited by Arcadia (edited August 25, 2001).]

--------------------
Arcadia
TYRant
Honorary Harpy
Honorary Magniac
[i]...a circle has no end...

------------------
"The conclusion is inescapable... mathematical thinking is, and must remain, essentially creative."

--------------------
The conclusion is inescapable... mathematical thinking is, and must remain, essentially creative.

HERE'S TO THE GREATEST PAIR OF ADMINS THIS SIDE OF TAARN VEDRA!!!

HIP HIP HOORAY
HIP HIP HOORAY
HIP HIP HOORAY

Rommie

------------------

Keeper of Rommie's Quarters
Roman Warrior and *official* Roman Greeter
DylaTrancer Ambassador to the ROMan Empire
Honorary Harpy, Trancer, Tyrant, Rhadical, Bekaneer, Bekancer, Than Hegemonist, and Dylanite
Keeper of Dylan's Pessimism
Sworn to Protect The GODDESS
Recipient of the Golden Rommie
(Sig Pic Courtest of Saine :))

I have avoided posting quite a bit for a few reasons, this troll/non-troll issue, emotions running high etc. I love this board and would hate to see it fall apart.

Thanks again,
Mai

------------------
The best lack all conviction, while the worst
Are full of passionate intensity.

- Yeats "The Second Coming"

Lady Maigrey's Andromeda Ascendant
http://www.ladymaigrey.com/

--------------------
"I try to take things one day at a time, but sometimes several
days attack me at once"

http://www.ladymaigrey.com/index-2.html

Oh, yeah, I had something to say too.

(Stands up and applauds loudly)

YES, this is GREAT, this is EXACTLY what we need.

{{{{{{{{{{{Christian}}}}}}}}}}}}
{{{{{{{{{{{Lisa @ Andi}}}}}}}}}}}
{{{{{{{{{{{All the mods}}}}}}}}}}}
{{{{{{{{{{{Murdock}}}}}}}}}}}}} You were right to tell us something was going to happen. Thank you.

{{{{{{{{{{{{{{Slipstreamers}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}

Thank you all

m_p_2001

And in the words of Trance--

"There, that's better."

Little Sue

Appreciation overflows -

thanks,

Yia

I call on all Romans, and all the other factions, to sign on that you, too, will support these new policies.

As I am.

------------------
Roman Emperor, Mocha Monarch, Grand Nagus of the Quarkies, Keeper of the Rommie-isms, Holder of the RNHoW2, Technomage, and Glitter Girl's slipstream daddy. Definitely Roman, also full Harpy, Honorary Dylanite, Tyrant, Trancer, Consensus Member, Than, and Keeper of Dylan's ship's Avatar, commander of the Roman Command Cruiser Hand of the Goddess, and pilot of the Conglomeration of Personas.
"A positive outlook on life and everything is quite contagious."

--------------------
[url=http://rommiesromans.homestead.com/sig1.html] If you want to see the full sig, click the pic. [i]recently updated[url=http://www.slipstreambbs.com/ubbmisc.cgi?action=getannounce&ForumNumber=7&Start=2452331.99&End=2452359&Session=]Please, donate to the new Slipstream server[/url]
[i]My gift is my song, and this one's for you.

Thanks!

------------------
One of these days and it won't be long,
Going down in the valley and sing my song.
Gonna sing it loud, sing it strong,
Let the echo decide if I was right or wrong.
-Bob Dylan

--------------------
Oh, time is short and the days are sweet,
And passion rules the arrow that flies.
A million faces at my feet,
But all I see are dark eyes.
-Bob Dylan

THANK YOU! sorry for yelling but I think this is great and I am doing the snoopy dance of joy right now. Thank you so much for digging in and getting this taken care of.

You are all awsome! {{{Christian, Lisa, Mods, and SS members}}}

Raises a toast to all... "To friendship, Andromeda and the Commonwealth may they live forever." (downs a glass of OJ cause it's still morning here

Thanks,

Deb

--------------------
Deb... aka GalaxyAnn
Dylanite,Proud Keeper of Dylans Personal Logs,
Honorary TYRant, Honorary ROMan,Honorary Magniac

I should never take a vacation again...

THIS SHALL BE DONE!

------------------
A Commonwealth Timeline/ANDROMEDA/All Systems U./L. Maigrey's Filk Archive
"No more 'Time Travel' stories EVER!" - Lil' Rommie
"What? Why not?" - Lil' Dylan
"Do y'have any idea what Time Travel does to my exterior finish??" - Lil' Rommie

--------------------
"Airlock Bungee" is NOT a good idea. "Mr. Turboscrub" is NOT your friend" - Lil' Trance's Notes to Herself

http://www.slipstreambbs.com/ubb/Forum7/HTML/005042.html

Where a comment that seems to be a flame was not rebuked by TPTB, but was rather counterflamed. By rights both posters should have gotten public warnings, yet nothing was done.
Can the Admins/Mods please explain why no action was taken and if this will be the case in the future. If so, then the new rules mentioned on this thread are just a waste of server space.

If private action was taken, I apologise and promise to be more observant in the future

Aurelius

------------------
Hail Rommie, Goddess of the Warship. To you I pledge my undying allegiance
Second in Command of the ROMan Empire and Leader of the ROMan Military
Governor of the ROMan Parthenon and War Council
General of the ROMan Smite Squad
Commander of the ROMan Heavy Battlecruiser Glory of Rommie
Devoted Husband to Saine

"He's right. I'm unloved, unwanted, unpopular...WHAM..unconscious" - Rygel

But anyway, you just have to brush off the negative as best as you can. There are problems, and there will always be problems... you can't stop that. But you can't let it stop you from enjoying the board... Persevere... Trust me.

[This message has been edited by Rob Hal (edited September 01, 2001).]

I love the sense of community we have here and I don't want to lose it.

And you know, I know what you're going through. I was one of the first TrekBBSers. I was there when we had but a handful of members, when there was that whole community atmosphere on the board. All of that has changed now, and I had to witness that. It wasn't easy... but the best way to get through is to keep having fun...

The board will change, I'll tell you that. (You may be fortunate though, cause you'll probably never have as many members as the TrekBBS...) And that sense of community will be lost for a bit, but it will come back, just in a different way....

And it's ironic that I'm telling you this...
Because at the TrekBBS, they'll tell you that I'm one that still clings to the hope that we can bring the BBS back to the way it was... One of the few Old Guard members left.. But, hey... things change....

If Neroon is a mod here too, something must seriously be wrong!

quote:

---

Originally posted by Rob Hal:
Wait, wait, wait!
I take it all back!

If [b]Neroon is a mod here too, something must seriously be wrong!
[/B]

---

LOL!! Just think it could've been you instead, then we'd all be in trouble.

--------------------
"Airlock Bungee" is NOT a good idea. "Mr. Turboscrub" is NOT your friend" - Lil' Trance's Notes to Herself

And, fellow Slipstreamers, this is a really fun place. I should know. I was here from the beginning.

Just use good judgement and respond to posts that bear merit and ignore those that don't. With no responses, the bad threads will get buried by the good ones until there are only good threads left.

Drawing a parallel to Dylan's quest to rebuild the Commonwealth. If you could only understand what this place was like before it fell into darkness, you would understand why all the mods have been pouring their blood, sweat, and tears into this place.

Present company excluded, of course.

------------------
m31@andromedatvfans.com
www.andromedatvfans.com

--------------------
------------
http://www.firflyfans.net/